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@conradhackett @sociology the cows get the land but I am pretty sure they are not even happy with it.

@redcat @conradhackett @sociology

I deserve every square inch and more!

@alrs @conradhackett @sociology Or we could rewild the land and grow proper forests on them again? But please show me first that most of that land is not suitable for anything less environmentally harming.

@alrs @conradhackett @sociology or you actually check out the source and see how actually a lot of the pasture land is in fertile regions.

@Rainbird42true @alrs @conradhackett @sociology stop pretending all of this used to be grassland

@DrCat @alrs @conradhackett @sociology The US has had a lot of grassland in the midwest US--buffalos roam. There are also areas where the trees were cut down, for example, in Indiana. My point is planting forests willy-nilly is not a magic solution and can make the situation worse. It is better if it's done thoughtfully by people who understand the history of the landscape and the trees best suited. Preserving existing forests is the highest priority. We are failing at that.

@Rainbird42true @alrs @conradhackett @sociology In general, if we want to rewilden these areas, the easiest would be just to leave them alone. If we got 1000s of animals on it, nothing is gonna regrow.

@DrCat @alrs @conradhackett @sociology Forests are not going to pop up on landscapes where the buffalo roamed. Species need to be able to move, which means fewer roads, and human hardscape. I don't know that cows are a big problem for wild species, but cows come with people. Rewilding a landscape and growing forests aren't necessarily the same thing. Dear can be a problem in boreal forests. Beef will become an elite item when we price water correctly.

@DrCat @alrs @conradhackett @sociology I'm saying it is complicated. In Indiana, it isn't animals, it's farming that caused deforestation. And farming gets in the way of the natural use of the land in lots of places. Parking lots and roads and housing developments get in the way of the natural use of land. I'm not even sure natural use of the land is possible on a planet with 8 billion people headed to 11 billion. It's discouraging

@Rainbird42true @alrs @conradhackett @sociology That's what I meant with use land efficiently and responsibly. Denser urban areas, more public transport and biking infrastructure. But even excluding ethical questions, purely from space usage, most of the animal agriculture has to be abolished and replaced with more sustainable alternatives. The Problem is not 8b people, its how resources are distributed and used.

@ulidig @alrs @conradhackett @sociology none of them have 1000s of cows on them in a small space.

@DrCat @alrs @conradhackett @sociology
Ok
https://tallgrassprairiecenter.org/prairie-pastures

@sarae @conradhackett that's the one that got me. That's an enormous amount of land for a single company!

@elisecutts @conradhackett @sociology I was surprised that golf was so much bigger than tobacco

@WJGunning @conradhackett @sociology Sure. as soon as you are able to digest grass and all sorts of funny weeds.

@vetdoc @WJGunning @conradhackett @sociology Why humans CAN digest grass, but why would you do that, rather than growing stuff we like to eat (of which many ARE from the grass family).

@jonashello @WJGunning @conradhackett @sociology Because the stuff, we would rather eat doesn't grow there. Vegans don't understand soil and farming, there is a lot of land, that is unfit for farming, like most of the West. And: Don't mix dairy and beef. They are fed differently.

@vetdoc @WJGunning @conradhackett @sociology 1. Every piece of land now used for farming was once "unfit for farming". 2. You don't need to use every bit of land, especially when everyone is vegan, as we use less land surface, and 3. there is ALWAYS something you can grow on land "unfit" for growing. E.g fuit trees or bushes if one doesn't want to plow.

@jonashello @WJGunning @conradhackett @sociology You see, you don't understand. How about water availability, soil errosion etc.? And: land that has been fit for farming once, has been turned into deserts due to growing the wrong crops and wasting water for irrigation.

@vetdoc @WJGunning @conradhackett @sociology So your saying if you grow the wrong way it doesn't work? That's really a good argument for animal agriculture!

@teachpaperless @conradhackett @sociology

the "100 wealthiest families" is what kills me.

@conradhackett @sociology They need a square for desert.

@TimWardCam @conradhackett @sociology the highways

@PopeSimonX @conradhackett @sociology Ta. I now see "rural highways", but I don't see urban roads and I don't see car parks. Weird fact about the USA: about half its street lights are in car parks. Does that mean that half the tarmac given over to cars is in car parks?

@TimWardCam @conradhackett @sociology my guess is they consider that to be part of "urban commercial" given most of the parking lots are owned by commercial companies.

But I feel like there isn't enough diversification of the data on urban land usage in general.

Yes, I know most of the US actually doesn't fit in that classification, but there is a lot of it that does.

@fabiank83 @conradhackett @sociology let take them in UFO

@MMGirlfriend @conradhackett @sociology I think I just found my life quote...or maybe my epitaph lol

@duanetoops @conradhackett @sociology It’s akin to world peace.

@MMGirlfriend @conradhackett @sociology with an added sweetness ...and less balls...